Writing Tips: POV

Why People Hate Your Story

The original → Chapter 3 ~ I will POV your eyes out (this seriously makes no sense. It's one of the reasons I started to rewrite this crap)

Chapter 16 ~ First Person point of view

These are references I checked out after writing. It's a lot of the same stuff but explained better. If you wanted more details, explanations, and pro-con lists, read these. But they are long.

1st Person

3rd Person Omniscient

3rd Person Multiple


Ah, the long awaited POV chapter. Not really, but is seems like a useful chapter nonetheless.

P.O.V. stands for Point Of View, as in the point of view of the narrator. There are many different types of POV and many different ways to write them. As I have stated many times on various occasions, NEVER DIRECTLY STATE WHOSE POV IT IS! That means that Kyungsoo’s POV  is absolutely taboo!

The three main types of POV are first, second, and third. First person is the type of fic in which the narrator uses words like “I, my, me, mine.” Second person are the “you” fics that are so infamous. Third person are my favorite type which uses words like “he did this, they ran there, she is here.” Of these three types, I will knock out second person right away.

The first two fics I wrote were in second person. At that time, all I knew about fanfiction was that it had female characters. The females were OCs that were supposed to reflect you, the reader, so my understanding was that I had to write it like that or it would be weird for one female to read about another random female. I still have that feeling now, but it doesn’t matter which perspective the story is written in.

Writing “you” is very weird. So is that concept of putting a blank. If I had to put it in harsh terms, which I obviously do, second person is the “noob” way of writing a fanfic.

Some problems I faced when writing those fics were:

1) My inability to substitute “you” for anything else.

See, when writing “you” fics, you start sentences with “you did this” and actions involving the “you” character go like “and he looked at you” and feelings are described as “the bubbling in your stomach made your heart flutter and cheeks burn.” The “you” person is almost never described as something else. It is very hard to do so and still allow the sentence to flow smoothly.

I’ve been revising my old stories, but the process is slow because I find myself lost in a sea of “you.” Probably 35% of my stories were made of that one word.

2) Seriously, I had another point, but my memory fails me once again at six in the morning.

There are always exceptions to the second person hate. I personally feel that the only exception is when the narration takes place in first person and is addressing another person. That could be like a letter or someone voicing their thoughts without the other one being there (sort of like this rant to you, the readers). This sort of writing can be very whimsical and works well.

 

First person, no matter how much I slam on it, is actually a very good way to write a story. If done properly, it can make the story consistent, entertaining, and heartfelt. First person is widely known as the perspective to use when you want more emotions expressed. The downside is that it is actually very hard to control.

That control is something I lack, so usually when I write in first person for my fics, I write with a continual stream of consciousness (okay, I do this with all my fics, no matter the POV). It’s the type of writing that makes my fics seem like reflective thoughts. I’m okay with my writing sounding disjointed and nonsensical, but not all stories sound good this way. On most occasions I try to avoid first person all together for the sheer reason that it doesn’t satisfy me on a literate level.

First person POV often tells not shows a story.

I respect literature that can describe things and reveal the finer details. Fantastic writing contains this description. First person often sounds like a list.
 

He is so hot. All the girls in school fawn over him. I hate him though. Who would like that arrogant stuck up bastard? Not me! Stupid Lee Minho, he thinks he can rule the school with his little F4 buddies. He thinks he’s all that. WELL HE’S NOT!
 

That sort of narration is like a child telling you about their day.

“Oh, how was your day, my child?”

“That stupid man , Lee Minho, was bullying kids again.”

For the record, I have not watched Boys Over Flowers.

This sort of narration can be avoided if you are aware of the problem, but it requires a type of writing that leads into third person voice with substituting narrator names with personal pronouns. That’s not bad, just saying, if you’re a stickler for following definitions…

It’s important to try and make all the characters feel alive, even if only one of them can actually freely express their emotions. A good story in first person will still show the personalities of the other characters. Just describe their actions and the environment around them. Proper characterization and execution of those traits can lead to a successful story.

First person POV makes narrators sound like an idiot. Fictional stories are often a retelling of events, so they usually happen in past tense. Because they are written in past tense, the reader is not technically supposed to know exactly what the narrator is thinking at that exact second.

In my earlier example about Lee Minho and F4, the “narrator” explains what she is thinking in real time. Instead of doing that, the story would sound better if her reactions were described.
 

The bullied boy ran from the classroom covered in trash and Lee Minho cackled wickedly, his evil deed done for the day. Shooting him a glare, I pulled out my handkerchief and raced after the boy.
 

Unnecessary thoughts are not included and even though “I” obviously am disgusted with Lee Minho, “I” don’t sound like an airheaded bimbo. Forcing those thoughts in is too extreme and can kill the story. So if your readers hate your narrator, this might be a major reason. Sometimes subtle details can be the most powerful ways of telling a story.

The only type of story that should sound like this is one that is one that is reflective. It has to follow the lines of “Looking back on my high school days, I really hated that guy for all he did.” This type of narration is actually intended to be told like someone relaying the events of the day, except they are not an immature child.

Writing in this POV also creates a similar problem with words appearing everywhere in the story. You can only refer to yourself as “Me” or “I” and not by another name like in third person, and the same is true for the character. They can not call themselves “the ugly one” or “the shy student.” And because they are narrating from a perspective that should be limited only to their actions and thoughts, most sentences end up focusing on the narrator. Because the sentence is focusing on them, they tend to start by referring to them. That’s how a lot of sentences have the same beginning with “I did this,” and “My face turned that way.”

This too can be avoided by some careful manipulation of sentence structure, but is becomes taxing, especially if you already have difficulty with sentence structure to begin with. If someone is not used to this writing, they could unintentionally change the overall effect of their writing into something else entirely.

No matter what the perspective though, try to vary the start of sentences. Reading a story that sounds very repetitive when it is not intended is very boring.

Another important note about first person is the reliability of the narrator. If the character is someone who is very strong willed and cunning, then their characters shouldn’t react the same way a helpless teen would. It is hard as an author to separate yourself from the character and create a completely different persona to reflect, but it has to be done. Writing about the same sassy brat that stands up to Lee Minho’s bullying story after story doesn’t work when you are actually trying to change the characterization.

This is not your narration, it’s the character’s, so let him or her narrate the story correctly.

If the story cannot be narrated from one person’s POV, try third person instead.

 

Third person is known as the perspective most common in fiction writing. When I was discussing this with another author, we got into the more specific categories –limited, objective, subjective, multiple, and omniscient. I’m not really going to label the different styles here. It’s kind of complicated and there are some rules that I don’t really care for because breaking them wouldn’t make someone hate your fic.

This type of POV is really good when there are multiple characters whose experiences need to be expressed. There have been a few authors who have asked me if it is okay to switch first person POV between chapters, and I told them it is okay, but they should probably just write in third person. As novice writers, it is easy to connect with the character and write in first person, but as a reader, the story is more enjoyable and easier to follow written in third person.

For your romances, for your high school fics, for your horror stories, for your science fictions, for your AU, writing in third person is very good.

Also, third person doesn’t have a lot of repetition with pronouns. Whereas “you” fics can only go by that or ______, and first person fics can only go by “I” and never an actual name, third person fics can refer to characters by name and even other methods like body descriptions. I know of one DBSK author who often calls Yoochun “the American.” This is your chance to call members by pet names. The dinosaur faced man, the panda eyed boy, duck , leader, maknae, clown, tall one, the red head, the diva. This is ten times more refreshing to read.

Since what you can write about is not limited to one person, a whole new realm of the story can be revealed. How does one express the misunderstood Lee Minho when the narrator is the female OC? It doesn’t work, so try third person. If you want the reader to understand everything (which isn’t always recommended) then use third person.

This wouldn’t be good if the story revolves around what some characters know and others don’t. For instance, if someone thinks their partner is cheating on them and in the end everything was a misunderstanding, it would be best if the reader didn’t know and there were just subtle hints to this conclusion. It can be really frustrating to read through several chapters of the main character acting in dislikeable ways when everything is for naught. (Those cases of “she loves him and he loves her, why don’t they just get together already?”)

Writing in third person still requires a level of consistency. No justice is made when you just hop from one character to the next. Not every character matters, even if you as the author feel very proud of each one you create. Limit the scenes you write about and the focus of those scenes to who is important!

With this, there is another advantage for third person POV. Though there are usually clear main characters for a fiction, no one character is responsible in the other parts of the story. You can write about character deaths or hypothetical situations and still maintain a proper flow. In first person POV, the story ends when the narrator dies. This gets rid of those boring moments when one character retells what happened to the main character since the main was not there to witness it.

Finally, with third person, it is easier for the author to show rather than tell a story. To go into further detail I would have to talk about the different types of third person POV, and I don’t really want to. It gets into technicalities and all that stuff that doesn’t make a difference on AFF. Because seriously, we’re talking about potato fics here.

 

In conclusion, “you” stories are never recommended. First person POV is recommended when the story is intended to have a more in depth look at the narrator’s emotions and can have a conclusion that the main character can reach (because it’s almost impossible to have an open ending when written in first person). Third person is recommended when there are multiple perspectives that need to be explained, when there is an open ending, or when plot is more important than feelings.

 

BUT ABSOLUTELY NEVER EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER CHANGE CHARACTER POVS IN THE MIDDLE OF A CHAPTER! NEVER REPEAT SOMETHING THAT HAS ALREADY HAPPENED WITH A NEW CHARACTER! NEVER EVER MENTION WHEN THE CHARACTERS CHANGE! NEVER EVER SAY THAT THIRD PERSON POV IS THE AUTHOR’S POV BECAUSE THE AUTHOR IS NOT IN THE STORY. YOU ARE NOT IN THE STORY! THESE ARE NOT AUTOBIOGRAPHIES! 

Seriously, POV problems don't really bother me, but if I see that beginner stuff, I really don't want to read the fic. That crap is why people hate your story. Also, vote this potato up. 

 

 

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Comments

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Scarlet_Sky
#1
Chapter 37: Ahhh, this was really entertaining to read. I love your tips... and also your sarcasm. lol
kesujo #2
Chapter 33: For me, I often just deal with subs-only stories by subbing to it temporarily, but most of the time, I read the first few chapters, lose interest, and unsub. I'm also like you where I firmly disbelieve in sub-only mode; there was one instance one of my stories was subs-only, and that was when AFF automatically marked every story with a trigger warning with members and subscribers only, and even then, as soon as I found they changed that, I removed the marker.
To me, someone who uses the sub-only option are those who don't have confidence in their own content to attract subscribers. But sub count isn't necessarily an accurate metric of viewership of your writing: if one wanted to do that, story statistics or chapter statistics is a better representation of how many people that still read your stuff
curiousdaffodil
#3
Chapter 28: Absolutely agree with you regarding description and dialogue.
I read some stories that lacked description and more dialogue. I want to explain to the authors about this, but because my english isn't really good and limited, I often don't know how to tell them and what to say to them. This really helps. ^^
Montai
#4
I love this
kesujo #5
Chapter 25: Hey, so reading this sorta made me think about chapter lengths ...

My chapters usually have, I'd say, around 3000 words each. Usually, my chapters are divided based on time skips (sorta).
That's not to say that I don't have a few time skips in my chapters, but I guess it'd be more accurate to say that I divide my chapters based on events. You know how some events will happen right next to each other and other events require some time to pass, right? That's sorta what I mean by that.
So I guess my question is: what do you think the ideal chapter length is (for you personally and what you think is the most effective for general reader bases, as in not just AFF but people who read in general)? Would something like 3,000 words suffice, or is the 10,000 word length better?
Of course, this question sorta varies from story to story (how it's laid out, how it's narrated, etc.), but from what you've seen, what's the best?
meangel
#6
Wow, this was published when I'd just turned 12 and I'm reading it now as an 18 y.o.
I do like writing a lot, and English is not exactly my mother tongue, yet I don't think my English is bad.. It's just not academic.

So hopefully with this, I'll improve my writing style as I continue my writings. I don't necessarily agree with all of your opinions but it has helped me improved a bit for now and hopefully will help me more in the future when I come back for more tips.

Thank you so much for this! It's truly appreciated!
charlislekim
#7
Chapter 37: just wanted to say that you have the best tips and i love it! you don't beat around the bush and get straight to the point! it really helped me^^

i agree with everything you said in all of your chapters, but that's how you attract readers in every website, right? haha aff, wattpad, etc, everyone wants a good dose of cliche and cheesiness :)
Twiceline_
#8
Chapter 9: I like how straightforward you are. It really helps with how my writing is and to be honest I have done a lot of the 'not to do' tips. Sometimes you're so straightforward its funny instead.
espoirtwt #9
Chapter 6: i'm laughing at the accuracy of these cliché plots. sometimes i give them a try, but i just can’t tolerate some.. it’s totally the same thing all over again and pointless to read.